The discussion for which this is the transcript is here.
極光 = northern lights
nature vs nurture = was it innate or was it learned
innate = born that way, born in to the person
—Our ancestors seriously discussed the idea of nature vs nurture 1000 years ago. Confucious said that humans were born good, we’re naturally good, but others, Mengzi, said that humans are born , can’t see evil, but at least not good, and we need to teach them to the right path.
that’s the two ideas we learned as a child. but neither of those ideas matter, we still also need to send kids to school to be educated, and this is since Confucious.
students can be molded in certain ways, based on your education system.
—can you explain to me what was this kind of education that surprised you?
—uh
—because i just read part of it, and I don’t understand the difference between a regular kindergarten, what do they do differently.
—the main points are
.keeping the kid segregated by sex
.understanding that boys and girls have certain basic tendencies based on their sex
.giving extra education to each sex to counter the tendencies of that sex
For example: boys are naturally more violent, (according to this article) so teaching boys self control and compassion, thinking about others
girls are naturally more compliant, so teach them self-reliance and independence
—so they separate the boys and girls into separate classes, and do so with different materials.
—I think it’s largely the same, with just some behavioural differences
—in the video the guy said, that gender segregation is NOT the goal, it’s just a tool, to work on the negative mirroring that children do
have you spent a lot of time around children?
—not a lot, but i have a niece and a nephew, and they’re getting very naughty right now. one’s already in kindergarten
—like 3 and 5
—one is two and one is around 4.
I don’t understand why they use this way to… Like they already know, or assume that boys are more violent and girls are more emotional, and they set this as a goal to do something that will counteract this result. For me I feel like it’s something like this. But to do it on purpose is not too good. And boys become more violent, girls play dolls or girly stuff, I think mostly because we’re affected by society. kids don’t know things, so we adults teach them. but we already have our concepts and ideas, and we project those things in their daily living. for example, last time I went to the US I bought two coloring books for my niece and nephew, I bought one is a car, and the other is Froze, and i thought the girl would take Frozen, but she took the truck. and I asked her mom, did you leave the truck one to the little boy, and she said, no, her daughter took the truck. and what about the brother? she said, they can play together. but I was thinking, why? I already projected that she would take that, but I didn’t realize she would also think cars are interesting. and I think it’s because we adults we project those kinds of ideas, and so when they grow up that’s how we see things. so if we give her a different environment, then she’ll adapt to it and have different living style. so that’s how I think about education for kids. so for gender equality, it’s what we show them that they learn.
—I think that’s the idea of this kindergarten too.
—I think it’s interesting, his experience. I also have two nephews, and I love them very much, now they’re like 4 or7, and I watched them grow up. and I remember the first time we went to the park together. I was holding my nephew and he was learning how to talk, and he saw the train on the walkway, and he was saying train. and he’s a boy, naturally he loves train, and I bought him a lot of that things, because he’s a boy and he naturally loved them. if I bought him dolls, I bet he would not touch them. but he naturally loved the train. so it’s natural. I kind of understand why iceland want to take this different approach. maybe they recognize the main difference between boys and girls, and they believe that a different approach that the result will be better than mixed gender groups. I’m curious about the result. are they satisfied with the experiment?
—there’s a section on the result. I feel like the criticisms are fairly weird
—it’s only for kindergarten, so they go back to normal school after
—so these are pretty weak evidence to say they work or not. it’s only for two or three years, and after that. I have no memory of kindergarten
—[did matter]
—I think it did matter, because I spoke fluent taiwanese, I was raised by my grandmother and grandfather. I spoke fluently according to my aunts, and I moved back to taipei and spoke mandarin all day, but my listening and comprehension is quite high.
—regardless of nature or nurture, education works
—yes, my nephews are learning the national anthem
Ólafsdóttir believes that girls are more socially capable, have a stronger "we" identity and seemingly have a natural desire to be caring and helpful.
Boys, on the other hand, are more individual, have a stronger “I” identity, show more initiative and are naturally drawn to games and things more than people.
—do you agree with that
—yes, I agree
—in my parent’s era, yes, I think it’s true. but for my mom, when she signed up for the military academy. she has 8 sisters and one brother. most of the sisters are teachers or office workers, but my dad’s side has two brothers, and they joined the military. partly because of we were poor, and partly is because of his physical health, and now he’s more on the educational side. but at that time, boys, served the country, and the relationship between taiwan and china is quite intense. and my grandparents, when their sons signed up, they never thought about going to war or not, we don’t even know where our next meal is coming from. so going to war is not important, as long as the gvt pays you. but for my mom’s family, my grandfather worked for the gvt, and they all got a good education, and when my mom said she’s going to join the military. and at that time, you had to sign a contract, and you needed your parents to sign. she took it to my grandfather, he just tore it up and told her to stay home. my grandfather, my mom’s father, he’s taiwanese, he didn’t join the military because he didn’t want to serve the japanese empire. so he tore the contract up, but my mom just secretly got another contract and signed it herself and went to the academy. and my grandfather was so pissed, and he said, whatever you have to face, I’m not going to help you. so the first day she went to the military, she got a shock, and she started crying, and called my grandfather to pick her up, and he refused.
—why did she join?
—I don’t know why
—you gotta ask her, that’s important.
actually I’m interested in iceland mainly because their soccer team was really good in the world cup. but they only have 300,000 people.
—no wonder they can get things done
—they have a very good tourist business, and fishing. but they have a lot of snow and winter, I wouldn’t live there. but their main resource is people, so they have to educate their people, to develop their country and can compete. So they tried this. I don’t know if it’s successful or not, to separate boys and girls, even though i doubt it works. I think mixed class is better than segregation, according to my own experience. but I truly admire their experimenting to do this, because they are making educated smart intelligent people to make their country smart and better. and they made it! that soccer team, that they can be so good to beat all the other teams, to make the final, this achievement. I actually watched the WC b3cause of iceland, otherwise it’s so boring, germany won again, france won again.
